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JustA -
Thanks. It does. I now understand what you were trying to say and agree wholeheartedly. I'm glad too that I don't have to think hard on your previous answer now . . . : )
posted by
sannhet
on November 16, 2004 at 6:48 PM
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Man…I have a lot to learn about writing.
I was just reviewing your post and my comments here and realized that they could be construed in error…so let me put my foot further into my mouth by trying to fix it. I was trying to express that I now see how people hold two very different perceptions of God. The first perception is that of an angry God that punishes for failure (thereby lacking true control) and the second perception is that of a confident God (with nothing to prove) one that loves all parts of his creation and knows that the over all path…is required. Unfortunately, many people try to force the two perceptions or concepts together…but this attempted merger…does not mix.
These two concepts create two very different languages…or understandings. One that is worldly (requiring conflict…or blame) and the other which is Godly (requiring nothing but acceptance of what is at this minute). While considering that “Heaven” is achievable right here, right now, I wrote my first comment here from the worldly perception. In other words, before Heaven is achieved there are some things that need to be fixed (conflict)(or rather…there are things that must come to pass).
Right now…mankind is at war with “God…right here in Heaven”…this war must conclude or run its course. Mankind believes that it can better Gods creation (and Heaven) through the use of manmade rules that are backed by force. The act of “believing” in these rules and the force required to uphold them…places an angel in Heaven (here in The Now)…that does not belong…this angel is a lie (liar) and will fall…from The Now…
I guess what I am trying to say is that mankind looks more to his rules and laws for protection (or salvation...being saved or protected by law) rather than accepting the will of God…accepting The God of Here and Now…man is worried more about tomorrow than he is about today…Right Now…
I hope this clears up my error…sorry…
posted by
justAcarpenter
on November 15, 2004 at 11:49 PM
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sannhet
Don’t think on my comment too hard…you made a very good point in this post…I was just babbling on about something else that I see occurring…maybe I will write some posts on it in the future…who knows?
posted by
justAcarpenter
on November 15, 2004 at 1:09 PM
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JustA -
Going to have to think on that a bit . . .
posted by
sannhet
on November 15, 2004 at 12:36 PM
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Just thinking out loud
Don’t be to quick to dismiss Revelations
Here in heaven…we have a little issue, a power struggle that has yet to be resolved.
And so the battle rages,
But a great angel soon will fall.
That’s because he is a liar,
And was never an angel at all.
Revelations is not about the future…its about “The Now”.
posted by
justAcarpenter
on November 15, 2004 at 12:02 PM
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Westwend -
You're right. "Kingdom" is too strong a word with too many negative connotations. I was just using it based on the verses I was referring to. But if we are going to get across the idea of a "new testament", then I need to stop using terms that confuse. I like your idea of spiritual realms based on the Greek translation.
posted by
sannhet
on November 15, 2004 at 7:20 AM
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instead of door
think threshhold.
posted by
Xeno-x
on November 15, 2004 at 7:01 AM
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very good!!!
first -- the imperial thing -- we get our ideas of "kingdom" from medieval feudalism. It looks like you are using a translation that just continued that idea. Hate to be critical but I wince when thses ideas are continued.
Which brings us to the real kingdom -- checking out Greek concordances finds that "kingdom" can be also rendcered, "realm", and that "heaven", spiritual; thus I render this phrase, "spiritual realms".
Bob Dylan's song, GATES OF EDEN, says a lot about that. I've reproduced the lyrics somewhere here. That song says the same thing as you are saying -- spiritual realms are here and now -- Eden is within oneself.
And yet spiritual realms also are coming. They are here and they are coming. constantly in the lives of those for whom they are already here. Always coming. We are always at the door to new realms of spirituality.
posted by
Xeno-x
on November 15, 2004 at 7:00 AM
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