Go to If I get smart with you....how will you know?
- Add a comment
- Go to Cut and Run Murtha Says Army Is 'Broken, Worn Out'
Hemlocker
As I first read through your remarks....I actually thought this was a genuine attempt to establish a dialogue...........but on second reading without the distractions of my business, I quickly realize it's far from that......
"you don't appear to be merely an hysterical idealogue"
Now there's a diplomatic way to start a dialogue....Merely?
I admire your ability to debate an issue in a reasonably intelligent and respectful manner.
Reasonably? Hmmmmm?
I'll address those two comments at the end of my response.
First of all it's hard to respond to questions that are worded in such a fashion that one even disagrees with the wording. I guess it falls back on the half-full/half empty paradox.
It's a matter of perception. I don't see this country in the condition you state. And I draw these conclusions from the economic information reported to us on a regular basis....Our economy is booming....... 10 straight quarters with growth above 3.3%. The longest period above 3.3 since WWII. And it's not a pseudo-boom like the dot.com experience.
There will always be poor....
My family was a typical blue-color family. My father was a Union official. ( I converted him in his later years). So don't think I am coming from a silver spoon in mouth background. I went to college through the use of student loans, which I actually paid back. And after working a decade in politics, I tired of the back stabbing, and started my own business..... The American Dream is attainable...and it doesn't come from the government.
Before you point out that my student loans came from the government.....actually, they didn't. They came from a bank and were only guaranteed by the government, in case, I pulled out and didn't pay, unfortunately, like so many thousands that don't.
I want to see the Federal Court system returned to the original intent of the framers of the Constitution. Legislating through the courts was never meant to be.
Health insurance for everyone? How are you going to pay for it. Do we want a tax burden on par with Canada or Europe? This country goes off the deep end when gas spikes above $3.00 a gallon.....What would happen to our economy, if we had an equivalent level of taxation on just gasoline? $4-5 a gallon for gas? Europe pays the same per barrel for the oil...what makes up the difference in price is the taxes to partially pay for their social programs.
So many factors tie together to influence the cost of health care...... For me, a good start is to change the system to limit the "Medical Lottery" produced by this country's lawyers. Feel you've been treated incorrectly? Earn Millions! Call our office!
We are to a point where, any time you go for treatment, you are barraged with tests and treatments that are more for the protection of the doctor than the patient. Doc, I've got a sore throat.....Corbin we'd better do a MRI. This adds tremendously to the cost of treatment. Caps on lawsuits would lessen that burden. But I just can't go along with a national health care plan..... As a nation, since FDR, we have slowly been trained to believe that we are "entitled" to certain benefits from the government.
Now FDR came up with the start of a brilliant political plan....slowly, but methodically, have a portion of the American population receive some sort of entitlement.......start with the elderly, move to the poor.....and the grand finale, hook the middle class. After hooking them, always scare the hell out of them by constantly proclaiming your political opposition is going to take their entitlements away..........
The only area I differ with our President on is the out of control spending by the Federal government....He has been distracted from that domestic issue.......like his father he's been distracted by a war.......
As to the war...why repeat over and over the same statements.....I clearly see it as a necessary evil....we must draw the line in the sand and I'd rather it be their sand. War is not a perfect solution to anything.......but it's better than the alternatives desired by these insane Islamofacists.
Now back to the top....do you realize how you come across with comments like the ones I listed?
Let me provide a few definitions for you:
smug 
( P ) Pronunciation Key (sm
g)
- Exhibiting or feeling great or offensive satisfaction with oneself or with one's situation; self-righteously complacent: “the smug look of a toad breakfasting on fat marsh flies” (William Pearson).
con·de·scend·ing ( P ) Pronunciation Key (k
n
d
-s
nd
)
To deal with people in a patronizingly superior manner.
Now to reinforce your perception of me.....In a movie called "Straight Talk", Dolly Parton played a radio personality called Dr. Shirley. I always remembered one piece of advice she gave a caller.....
"Get Down Off Your Cross, Honey.......Somebody Needs the Wood!"
Isn't that interesting? I think of it every time I realize I'm taking myself too damned seriously.......
It was nice talking with you..........
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on December 3, 2005 at 4:41 AM
| link to this | reply
Hemlocker..
I'll discuss your questions later this evening when back at home...
Today's a busy day in my business........
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on December 2, 2005 at 8:27 AM
| link to this | reply
Corbin--
I've been thinking more, because you don't appear to be merely an hysterical idealogue, what are your hopes and goals for our so-called "democratic" nation at home and in the world? What kind of a country and people would you like us to be ten or twenty years from now? How would you approach grinding poverty, powerlessness, thirty-six million people without health insurance, hard working families suffering and having to be on food stamps, and losing their homes because they no longer can afford the mortgage? This is just a beginning. Rather than merely post in an adversarial way against everything you think people on the left stand for, why don't you do a post addressing your vision for a future United States of America. I'd certainly look forward to reading it.
posted by
Hemlocker
on December 2, 2005 at 8:07 AM
| link to this | reply
Corbin--
I may disagree with much of your conservative philosophy, but I admire your ability to debate an issue in a reasonably intelligent and respectful manner. I felt Saddam could be dealt with without starting a war which, on top of ten years of sanctions, hurt the Iraqi people so much, especially the children. Saddam was a client of the U.S. when it suited our goals at the time. We provided intelligence and much of the notorious weapons of mass destruction--along with West Germany and other Europeans--in his war with Iran, which killed over a million people--and how was anyone bettered when that war finally ended?
I don't agree with everything "LibDems" say--especially those trying not to appear "too left" because they have further political goals, but I can see, as Nancy Pelosi does, what with all the scandals around mostly Republicans, that the party in our time, has become a "culture of corruption". I am 63 years old. I've been in the Army and though I opposed the Viet Nam War, I would have been there in the Special Forces as a medical specialist--training for which I applied and was accepted--except for failing an isochromatic color identification test which would have made me an excellent target for snipers and other guerilla sorts. I've not been anti-military, or even anti-war under such circumstances as existed with the Nazis. But inflicting war and massive suffering upon people like the Iraqis, as an instrument of foreign policy, then saying critics of it are "reprehensible", to me is immoral in the highest sense, and even--though I hesitate to use the word for members of my own government--evil. 
posted by
Hemlocker
on December 2, 2005 at 7:56 AM
| link to this | reply
OFFBEATS
The louder they scream the closer to the truth one must be.....
I deleted Mystic's "LIAR" comment. Over the edge a bit, I think.
If you think this is bad..........
You should see some of the e-mail I have received....I'm glad I have a good firewall and virus scan....I've had 2 that were rejected because of malicious content (worms).
These tactics don't bother me...if we let them, then they have won. And we have changed too much to allow a return to their kind of thinking.
Our accomplishments aren't to shabby for a bunch of troglodyte cowboys...and there more yet to do....but that's for another day and another post......
Still got some snow? Is mine coming by UPS or FEDEX?
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on December 2, 2005 at 5:16 AM
| link to this | reply
Hemlocker
Quite the contrary...I am not attacking Murtha....I am disagreeing with what he says.....
As to the views of the LIBDems here.....They must be a very satisfied lot....for they do nothing but attack the President in every way imaginable.....
The importance of Murtha's speech was that it vaulted over those laboriously prudent schedules (of Democrats like Feingold, Kerry and Hillary Clinton, who argues, that withdrawal would be 'a big mistake' ..
Actually, the Murtha's speech and subsequent media tour was much more important for the party here at home......You see, it's pumped new life into the Far Left that now controls the Democrat party. Sort of throwing them a bone. The old liners that still control the party apparatus is wary of the free-wheeling ways of the move-on crowd....a bit to radical and uncontrollable you see. Secondly, it gives a fresh face to the media swarm. Why he's a hawk! And he's seen the light! What he said, other than the withdrawal thingy, is no difference from what he's been saying since 6 months after the war started.
As his military sources in Iraq urged him to point out, the main fuel for the Sunni Arab insurgency is foreign occupation.
Murtha's military sources? What? We now have a shadow government? Ahhhh, so now it's the Sunni Arab conspiracy......Is Al - Zarqawi a sunni? Are the insurgents being shipped in from Iran Sunni? The main fuel for the Sunni is....THEY WANT THEIR POWER BACK. Do you support a return to the situation where the minority Sunni have all of the power? I hope not.
It's obvious that from your comments that you don't feel there is any connection with Islamofascist terrorism.........Terrorism isn't even mentioned in anything you have said.
Using hypothetical outcomes is a great way to speculate, but that doesn't make them any more likely to happen or any less hypothetical in their content.
How does one plan a war? Has there been any war that has gone right along with the initial plan. Has there been any war that been mistake free? We had 749 GI's killed in a training incident on the coast of southern England in one day....I'm sure it wasn't planned that way.
All the evidence shows that only an agreement on the U.S. departure (which more than 60% of the American people now support) will lead to an end to the armed resistance, just as Murtha said.
What evidence might that be? As to the polls.......as I have said in the past. This is the best example of why our founding fathers didn't want a democracy or a parliamentary form our government....too fluid, too responsive to the emotional ebb and flow of the electorate.
In two weeks there is going to be a monumental event in the geographic heart of Islam.....the people of Iraq are going to participate in choosing their government......
The radical Islamics know what this bodes for their plan of an New Islamic Empire. Nothing a Conservative could say will change the opinions and activities of the Left. So we just need to go on and take care of business.....according to the overall Geo-Political strategery ( I love that Bushism). And then we can focus on Iran, next.
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on December 2, 2005 at 5:07 AM
| link to this | reply
katray
Thanks so much for stopping by....
I haven't called him a Liar, impugned his intelligence, ridiculed his speech patterns, or even smeared his children...like some here have do to the President......
I take specific statements he has made and critique those statements........I even point out that I feel sorry for him......he is being used, I am attacking those "handling" him.
Those attacking Leiberman, weren't taking issue with the things he said...but instead through the use of innuendo, attempted to dismiss everything carte blanche because he's a supporter of Israel.......
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on December 2, 2005 at 4:18 AM
| link to this | reply
Bud-Oracle
you are far out as well my goosestepping friend.
Fur sure, dude............I wonder how long it would be before the Nazi phrase would pop up. I guess it's a favorite tactic of the left in Canada, too.
I love it here in the rugged battled fieds of words. At least here the nonsense that you spoiut, bdoesn't draw blood and venom, and reign terror on your next generations. And most people can see through your nonsense without pain.
And your Anti-American rate on you blog has the same impact....you see from time to time our little brothers from the north have these little tantrums, hissy fits to some......as with most little brothers....they just want some attention.
All they need to do is click to somewhere else.t w
You're certainly right on at least that point, one can come here without invitation or not..........now go put some gravy on your French fries....
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on December 2, 2005 at 4:01 AM
| link to this | reply
CorbinDallas
The protector of the fifth element, I am surprised at the comments made in your comment section, but by now we should be used to it...one thing I can tell by all your writings in the past is that you are informed, and by God your not a liar as one blogger called you...sometimes we must consider the source. Typically when a blogger comes out and calls you a liar, I am reminded that it is impossible to talk to some liberal/Dem who can not engage in a debate about the subject, rather call sprew names without any reason. I checked it twice and I find nothing your lied about, maybe that's why some smart woman wrote the book about how to talk to a liberal.. You work is always factual and informative!
posted by
Offy
on December 2, 2005 at 3:28 AM
| link to this | reply
you are far out as well my goosestepping friend. I love it here in the rugged battled fieds of words. At least here the nonsense that you spoiut, bdoesn't draw blood and venom, and reign terror on your next generations. And most people can see through your nonsense without pain. All they need to do is click to somewhere else.t w
posted by
Bud-Oracle
on December 1, 2005 at 10:02 PM
| link to this | reply
Well this certainly slipped into a personal attack!
Interesting and revealing how you did the same thing here to Murtha that you accused me of doing to Lieberman. Hmm..Hard to accept I suppose that this proud warrior is in touch with the military minds and realities of Iraq.
A little fact about those four out of eighteen provinces that are consumed by violent attacks: they contain the capital of the country and nearly half the population; hardly an insignificant portion of the country as some would lead us to believe.
posted by
Katray2
on December 1, 2005 at 9:59 PM
| link to this | reply
Ah, Corbin--
Ridiculing and attacking those who hold different views is so satisfying. We are in Iraq for empire, not "democracy". I honor the brave and committed "imperial grunts" but soldiers don't make foreign policy--although the Bush Administration is using ours to make policy in another part of the world. Consider this comment by the "LibDem" (thus contemptible to you) journalist Alexander Cockburn:
The importance of Murtha's speech was that it vaulted over those laboriously prudent schedules (of Democrats like Feingold, Kerry and Hillary Clinton, who argues, that withdrawal would be 'a big mistake' ...'that would cause more problems for us in America...it will matter to us if Iraq totally collapses into civil war, if it becomes a failed state.') to what is actually happening in Iraq. As his military sources in Iraq urged him to point out, the main fuel for the Sunni Arab insurgency is foreign occupation. So long as it continues, the resistance is likely to go on.
Bush knows this and it is fine with him, because, as he said in his recent speech at Annapolis, "victory" is the goal "as long as I am your commander-in-chief". How many lives are lost, both American and Iraqi (civilians being most of the casualties) is really immaterial in the Neo-Cons overall scheme of things, i.e. to consolidate one-party power at home, and establish American-style empire abroad.
Would there actually be a power vacuum followed by civil war if the United States withdrew? The Sunnis can't take Baghdad. They can't penetrate the main Kurdish or Shiite areas. How exactly is the U.S. military preventing a civil war at the moment? The refusal of the Shiites to retaliate is the most important factor here, and this is primarily the result of Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani standing firmly against it.
Now suppose Sistani calls for a withdrawal. Then the United States and Britain will have little choice but to go, probably over an eighteen-month period. As recently as late November a gathering in Cairo of Sunni, Shiite and Kurdish leaders (under the auspices of the Arab League) called for a timetable for U.S. withdrawal and also said that Iraq's opposition had "a legitimate right to resistance." The Sunnis are not going to stop fighting while the occupation continues. The quid pro quo for U.S. withdrawal presumably would be a cease-fire by the Sunnis, and an end to suicide bombing.
Would the president consider this to be "victory"? All those Democratic Party's withdrawal dates are predicated on the idea that the Iraqi army and security forces will be built up and can take over. This scenario is as unrealistic as all those calls to 'internationalize' the occupying force. All the evidence shows that only an agreement on the U.S. departure (which more than 60% of the American people now support) will lead to an end to the armed resistance, just as Murtha said.
Sorry to take up so much of your space, Corbin, but there is a great deal more to this debate than the simplistic argument of "cut and run" versus "stay the course".
posted by
Hemlocker
on December 1, 2005 at 8:44 PM
| link to this | reply
Another reason for the redeployments
"The only reason some of our troops are on their third deployment is that our military has been rotating them in and out to keep them fresh and get them home for a while."
Not to mention the continuing high rate of - ahem! - voluntary re-elistment! Excellent post!
posted by
WriterofLight
on December 1, 2005 at 5:44 PM
| link to this | reply
Let's look at something our broken military is doing.....
Does everyone eemember Sadr City...the Shiite slum in Bagdad..that was a nest of trouble and fighting last year.......
From Good News From the Front:
The troops have succeeded in turning Baghdad's Sadr City into an oasis of peace and quiet:
Crammed into armored Humvees heaving with weapons, Lt. Col. S. Jamie Gayton and his soldiers were greeted by a surprising sight as they rolled into one of Baghdad's poorest neighborhoods. Men stood and waved. Women smiled. Children flashed thumbs-up signs as the convoy rumbled across the potholed streets of Sadr City.
It was a far more welcoming scene than the urban war zone of a year ago, when U.S. troops and black-clad guerrilla fighters battled in the narrow alleys of the squalid slum.
"We're making a huge impact," Gayton said as his men pulled up to a sewer station newly repaired with U.S. funds. "It has been incredibly safe, incredibly quiet and incredibly secure."
Sadr City has become one of the rare success stories of the U.S. reconstruction effort, say local residents, Iraqi and U.S. officials. Although vast swaths remain blighted, the neighborhood of 2 million mostly impoverished Shiites is one of the calmest in Baghdad. One U.S. soldier has been killed and one car bomb detonated in the last year, the military says.
The improvements are the result of an intense effort in the wake of the street battles last August with fighters loyal to anti-American cleric Muqtada Sadr. Within a month, U.S. officials decided to make Sadr City a showcase for rebuilding, and increased spending to $805 million in a neighborhood long neglected under Saddam Hussein.
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on December 1, 2005 at 5:23 PM
| link to this | reply
Corbin
I think he has a senile problem..or selective memory maybe..
What I find odd is the military does not see itself losing this war, defeat is not an option here, and from the beginning we were told it was going to take 5 years to get this job done right! One does not build a new democracy, train police and army, rebuild old and decaying intrastructure in a couple days...it took the infomation officer of Baghdad ( Baghdad Bob) 3 days just to admit the darn forces were indeed in front of the broadasting studio... hello?? Yes, Murtha may want to be more famous and a Michael Moore could do that...like I said, the man has issues, one of them is he's living in a state of denial and confusion over which war is being fought!!!
posted by
Offy
on December 1, 2005 at 4:56 PM
| link to this | reply
Corbin Dallas
Thank you! I agree with you completely, I think I'm seeing a change of attitude in the small area that surrounds me. Take care and keep up the good work! 
posted by
BrightIrish
on December 1, 2005 at 4:51 PM
| link to this | reply
BrightIrish
I am glad your son made it back safely, it saddens me when I see the numbers going up on the deaths. Some here would say we Conservatives are enjoying the losses. They are only displaying their ignorance with such statements. All Americans should ache with each and every family's loss.....
But to cut and run will only bring greater losses right here at home....I just get so damned tired of reading comment after comment tearing down the President, his administration, and in the end the efforts of our troops in the war.
What they don't get is that their efforts are going to backfire on them......The President is back up to 46% in some polls....I don't follow polls, too much of the emotion of the moment is involved in their numbers....I thought I would throw it in, since so many Leftist here were getting so orgasmic when they were going down.......all you'll hear is the chirping of the crickets from them as they head back up.
I'd also like to say a big thank you to your son, God Bless him for caring enough about this country to serve by his own choice...........
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on December 1, 2005 at 4:26 PM
| link to this | reply
Corbin Dallas
Hi.. My son has made a career of the Army and will retire in June. He returned home from Iraq 4 months ago.. He is proud of what we are accomplishing there and proud of Our President and his determination. His only complaint was that he didn't want to see sand for awhile. 
Corbin, thank you for all of your supportive posts and your willingness to defend our troops and their cause, I would also like to thank you for your service to Our Country! 
posted by
BrightIrish
on December 1, 2005 at 4:14 PM
| link to this | reply
Xeno.......
you know my point
lots of fog and flak.
Now I have to agree...that's a pretty good summation of your points........
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on December 1, 2005 at 4:09 PM
| link to this | reply
Flame-thrower mentions the most telling point of all - 3 of 18 Iraq
provinces are safe.
posted by
reasons
on December 1, 2005 at 3:59 PM
| link to this | reply
well I thought the administration
when they talked about the coalition
were talking about the invading forces
that's what they called it way back then.
you know my point
lots of fog and flak.
posted by
Xeno-x
on December 1, 2005 at 3:53 PM
| link to this | reply
Oh,and Xeno
I served in the Military........have you?????
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on December 1, 2005 at 3:52 PM
| link to this | reply
Xeno-x
Here we go again........
How many Iraqi forces are being killed? Aren't they part of the coalition to you?
Or do you think of them more as being like the Vichy French....you know, lapdogs for the American invaders?
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on December 1, 2005 at 3:50 PM
| link to this | reply
Flame-thrower
When's the last time you saw anything about those areas on CNN, CBS, NBC, or ABC? They would have us believe that the entire country is up in arms......
It's not helped by many, like our Leftists here, that make absurd statements with out a single shred of evidence to back it up. Statement like 80% of Iraqis want us out of Iraq. The unemployment is 60%....hell, it called a war! What do you expect?
Of course they can't help it....there were used to 8 years of kowtowing to war lords in places like Mogadishu, Sudan, and Yemen. Lob a couple of cruise missiles......do high level bombing in the Balkans so no planes will get shot down....do want to see any casualties in the news, you know.
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on December 1, 2005 at 3:46 PM
| link to this | reply
flame-thrower -- coalition forces?
let's see -- over 90% of the forces are U.S.
2nd is U.K., with less than 10% of that.
then the rest are there with a few dozen, a few hundred, no more than 2,000 for any one country --
the "coalition" is more or less of a cover up for a primarily U.S. action. And U.S. troops are bearing the brunt of the fighting and dying.
posted by
Xeno-x
on December 1, 2005 at 3:41 PM
| link to this | reply
a whole you know about the military
check out the other wars
people weren't sent back as soon, I am sure, as they are now.
person power is at a premium
the military is calling back people who thought they were totally retired and finished.
people are being kept way beyond their expected tour of duty.
these are hints at a crisis.
odd how you typify this war as being just in Iraq -- insinuating that if the military can secure Iraq's borders then the war will be won.
many Vietnam Vets came home disillusioned about that war, against it. I spoke to several like that. They wanted to see their comrades brought home and not in body bags -- but through the U.S. withdrawing.
I wonder how many military personnel have similar feelings about the military action in Iraq?
posted by
Xeno-x
on December 1, 2005 at 3:38 PM
| link to this | reply
Great work of pointing out the lapses. The war in Iraq is being won by coalition forces.Listen not to the Press for they are based only in the Sunni triangle.That is three provinces and Iraq has 18 in total. The north is safe and the south.
posted by
Flame-thrower
on December 1, 2005 at 3:32 PM
| link to this | reply