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saul relative, I have a new appreciation for the word 'fundamentalist'
ever since I considered the term, 'fundament' as it applies to anatomy.
posted by
Ciel
on March 11, 2007 at 11:41 AM
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Good lord, Ciel, are you trying to start a religious war with the
fundamentalists?
For what it's worth, I believe you're right.
posted by
saul_relative
on March 11, 2007 at 9:40 AM
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Ciel
Thank you Ciel for a very profound, thought provoking post.
posted by
johnmacnab
on March 10, 2007 at 10:45 AM
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Excellent post
posted by
malcolm
on March 10, 2007 at 3:03 AM
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Thanks for your comment, Decshak--
You have reinforced my point, that each of us has our own understanding and interpretation of the words and the meanings. Discussion of our personal variations can add depth to all our appreciation of it, too.
posted by
Ciel
on March 9, 2007 at 2:43 PM
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I really like "source-of-our-spirit" but I had a different interpretation
for "deliver us from evil". I was thinking of that more in the context of "lead us not into temptation" as in help us to avoid doing or thinking evil things.... But that's just me, after all. You've got the right idea here. Actually, a brilliant idea to work this thought process out "on paper" for all to share. And thanks for your brilliant examples that you left over at my blog!
posted by
WindTapper
on March 9, 2007 at 2:06 PM
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Whacky and Bo, I agree--even for those who get addicted to 12-stepping,
it is a healthier state of affairs than their original addiction! I think it is a huge step when an addict faces the fact that his/her addiction has hurt people, and that that matters.
posted by
Ciel
on March 9, 2007 at 10:20 AM
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Thanks for your comment, Bhaskar--
I think we asked and received from Sannhet!
posted by
Ciel
on March 9, 2007 at 10:17 AM
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You explained it beautifully, Sannhet!
What you say about the effect of the congregation is literally true, that the energy is intensified: "Wherever three or more are gathered in My name..." I have felt it in a concert hall, too, where everyone was together on the same wavelength of music. And I guess the other side of this coin is when 'mob mentality' gets out of control and creates mayhem and havoc, and afterwards, no one knows quite what happened.
Thanks for sharing this!
posted by
Ciel
on March 9, 2007 at 10:15 AM
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Ciel -
As I said, we are approaching the choosing of a church (we've narrowed it down to three, actually) based on intent, rather then on "window dressing". Though I am not one for organized religion, I do go because I can usually find some nugget of Truth during my time there - whether from something a minister or priest says, in talking with folks in the congregation - or even during silent prayer there (prayer seems much more powerful when done in a church setting). And those nuggets of Truth usually point to intent.
It's been my experience that some churches are only interested in making one feel ashamed and guilty (nothing but a power approach). Some churches focus on sin, to the detriment to everything else (a fear-based approach). Some churches are driven by doctrine and "laws", not by people (again, a power approach). But some churches, while perhaps focusing on sin, are also focused on loving those who sin rather then in making them feel ashamed. One church we visited is such a church. Their window dressing is all about how sinful we are. But behind the window dressing is a group of people who are all about forgiveness and love. Their intent is love. And it is at a place like this that one will find precious nuggets of Truth to help one better see the path to reunification with the Divine. I hope I explained this well enough . . .
posted by
sannhet
on March 9, 2007 at 7:19 AM
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ciel
sannhet's comment is quite interesting and intriguing, which I think i'll need to know as well. A good write-up. To me, as I prefer addressing God - it is the universal energy, all-pervading, and the source of all life forms.
posted by
Bhaskar.ing
on March 8, 2007 at 9:11 PM
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Those 12 steps have helped a lot of people.
A smile
from Bo =^..^= and one
from me!
posted by
Whacky
on March 8, 2007 at 8:41 PM
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Sannhet, I'm interested to know which you choose, and why, and
how you like it after a while.
posted by
Ciel
on March 8, 2007 at 4:48 PM
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Ciel -
I run into the same problem as you from time to time. Most recently, it has happened in trying to find a church that my wife and I are comfortable with since we have moved. Each one we visited just didn't fit what we were looking for. Until we decided to forget the symbols and get to the intent. Once we did that, we now have several churches that we need to choose from, rather then having none.
posted by
sannhet
on March 8, 2007 at 2:50 PM
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