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Islam and Christianity
I believe that a mojor difference between Christianity and Islam is that Christ did not live long enough to "develope" the religion. I think of it as an orphan faith, that grew up without its parent, but with Islam it is different :Muhamamd had 20 years to supervise, instruct, and answer the questions of his followers. If Jesus had lived to be 60 as Muhammad did he might have had more rules regarding the daily life of his followers.
As for "the subjugation of the non-believers" I think that it was practiced by Christians ( although not by Jews as far as I know) :The forced conversions carried out by Spanish in the New World is one example.
posted by
lindo
on May 25, 2007 at 4:08 PM
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Re: Islam and Judaism
lindo, I love it that I am finally engaged in a lucid, rational and dispassionate debate with an articulate Muslim.
I consider (and I follow generally accepted understandings in anthropology and sociology) that 'rules regarding food, prayer and general everyday life', if not merely 'customary', but demanded by the tribe's deity and adhered to, form an important part of what I have called 'tribal rigidity'.
Islam dictates the believer's daily life in ways Christianity does not, at least not today. (And it rarely ever did to the same extent.) Of course, not all Muslims may actually adhere to what is demanded by the Koran or hadith...
It is my contention that the current, and growing, problem of Islamo-fascism has arisen in part because its adherents unfortunately treat, or pretend to treat, the relevant verses (those dealing with the subjugation of the infidel) as an ongoing 'mantra' for all time...
There are no similar texts in the Old Testament, let alone in the New Testament, which demdnd the subjugation of the non-believer...
posted by
Nautikos
on May 25, 2007 at 12:31 PM
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Islam and Judaism
I was not thinking of tribal rigidity when i compared islam to Judaism, but more of the rules regarding food, prayer and general everyday life. The concpet of fighting the infidels refers to the early expansion period, it wasn't meant as a credo for all time, unfortunately many understand the present tense used in many of these verses as an ongoing mantra, it isn't and it shouldn't . which brings us back to the issue of misinterpretation and hijaking the faith to fulfill a political agenda. Still, if you look back at history, more people were killed in religious wars or wars between people with differing views on one faith (Christianity included) than for any other reason.
posted by
lindo
on May 25, 2007 at 1:04 AM
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Corbin
Pakistan's Tribal Areas became a haven for al Qaeda and Taliban not by design but by chance. Intensely 'tribal', backward and traditionally hostile to the authority of Islamabad, it was a 'natural' refuge for the Taliban and al Qaeda leaders and many of their followers, especially after the their defeat in Afghanistan...
posted by
Nautikos
on May 24, 2007 at 10:56 AM
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Lindo
There is, of course, a certain amount of 'tribal' rigidity in orthodox Judaism. However, one of the significant differences is that it is not militantly hostile towards 'infidels'...
posted by
Nautikos
on May 24, 2007 at 10:49 AM
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Naut.....
On......
Tribal area a sanctuary for TalibanWhen I first heard of this I thought it may be a plan to isolate the Taliban leadership and kill or capture them......alas, it is not the case......
posted by
Corbin_Dallas
on May 24, 2007 at 7:12 AM
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Naut you are right in some way
Isalm is a faith, but like Judaism it does govern certain aspects of everday life, dress, I believe, is a grey area where we are required to be modest but not walking tents. one reason why it feels that it is rooted in Arabic culture is because of Sunna (the way of the prophet Muhammad), many think that it means copying all his actions without taking into consideration these were often dictated by the time and place that he had lived in, not to mention his personl taste and preferneces. My personal view is that Sunna is about ambracing the essence of his life and teachings and not the ways of 7th century. Taliban, seem not to know the difference.
posted by
lindo
on May 23, 2007 at 1:18 PM
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lindo
thanks for your comment! Just as I thought, incidentally, I just wasn't sure. But it underscores something I have maintained all along, that Islam is not 'just' a religion, but a very specific way of life, rooted in Arabic culture. And it is certainly interesting that
some groups can claim that certain customs are divinely sanctioned, as the Taliban obviously do.
posted by
Nautikos
on May 23, 2007 at 6:13 AM
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correction to my comments naut
The incedent regarding buying the beard concerns a master of Alansar: Qais Bin Al Zuhair who converted to Isalm as young lad and was close to Muhammad ,but I suppose the story still proves how beard was a sign of maturity in that society. sorry about the mixup
posted by
lindo
on May 23, 2007 at 3:11 AM
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Naut
Isalm stresses the importance of hygene but i think the beard is a cultural thing. There is a story about one of the best Pre-Isalm orators, he had no facial hair, it distressed his tribesmen so much they said something like if they could give him some of their own facial hair they would not hesitate
Still here in Syria, when i take my son to the braber i find guys not only shaving but also having the finer facial hair waxed. Ouch!!!
posted by
lindo
on May 23, 2007 at 1:44 AM
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Offy,
We'll never know, hon. Nor does it matter, since they're all wearing burkas anyway...
posted by
Nautikos
on May 22, 2007 at 5:41 AM
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Naut
I am sure if they are not letting the men shave then there must be a lot of hairy legged women running around over there...
posted by
Offy
on May 22, 2007 at 4:47 AM
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Offy
To be honest, I can't remember offhand what it says about shaving in the Koran, or if it says anything. I
do know that there is nothing in the Koran about wearing burkas!
posted by
Nautikos
on May 22, 2007 at 4:45 AM
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lindo
Thanks! I read your post, very impressive, and left a comment. It will probably lead to another post.
posted by
Nautikos
on May 21, 2007 at 5:33 PM
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Naut
I don't understand how people can live with these sort of rules. Is it really un Islamic to shave or is that something taken out of context from the Koran? We must hope the good President is remains successful in Pakistan!
posted by
Offy
on May 21, 2007 at 4:12 PM
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Thanks for the link Nautikos
I hope you had a good time at your party. Check my blog for a post inspired by what i found at the link you sent me.
posted by
lindo
on May 21, 2007 at 4:04 PM
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Wavy
One can't run Pakistan like a Western democracy, and those who criticize him may well understand that, but criticize him anyway because of their own agenda...
posted by
Nautikos
on May 20, 2007 at 5:56 PM
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Naut
I hope that the Pakastani leader remains in power. I heard on CNN Late Edition earlier today that some people in Pakistan are upset with him because of his autocratic actions but the Taliban is far worse than him. Maybe lice will grow in the beards of these Taliban men.
posted by
WavyDavy
on May 20, 2007 at 2:37 PM
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Justi
Islamists getting into power in Pakistan would truly be a nightmare scenario...
posted by
Nautikos
on May 19, 2007 at 5:30 AM
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Nautikos
That president knows it only takes Al Qaeda getting their hands on their Nuclear arsenal to change the face of the earth. If he dies, gets tired of putting up with guarding, it is over.
posted by
Justi
on May 18, 2007 at 8:16 PM
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Thanks, Troosh
posted by
Nautikos
on May 18, 2007 at 2:21 PM
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Naut
What an extremely informative, eye-opening, and well written post. You do your "homework" and research well.
posted by
Troosha
on May 18, 2007 at 7:55 AM
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TAPS
Islam is
all about fear and submission...
posted by
Nautikos
on May 17, 2007 at 4:09 AM
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Justi
Well, things appear to be under control for now, but I can see Pakistan emerging as a huge problem in future...
posted by
Nautikos
on May 17, 2007 at 4:07 AM
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Naut - Good Morning
Precisely my point.
posted by
FoliageGold
on May 17, 2007 at 4:06 AM
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Foliage
that's a scary pussy cat...
posted by
Nautikos
on May 17, 2007 at 4:04 AM
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Enigmatic
Enigmatic, we're faced with thinking here that is so strange, it
does seem
surreal...
posted by
Nautikos
on May 17, 2007 at 4:00 AM
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Nautikos
"I will obey because I am afraid." What a pitiable way to have to live. In fact, is life really worth living in a place where one has to feel that way?
posted by
TAPS.
on May 16, 2007 at 7:28 PM
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Nautikos
A very good post. This gives a picture of some of the lengths they will go to get their demands met. This is but the tip of the iceberg. It is good their ruler is as strong as he is or it would all come tumbling down and bring incredible trails of tragedy with it.
posted by
Justi
on May 16, 2007 at 6:03 PM
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Naut
This is utterly amazing.........had to read it three times. Very well written. 
posted by
FoliageGold
on May 16, 2007 at 5:44 PM
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Nautikos
This all seems so surreal, it's hard to believe that it's really real - but I know it is.
posted by
Enigmatic68
on May 16, 2007 at 5:34 PM
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